NY Times Op-Ed Compares Refugees To The Story Of Jesus’s Birth

The parents of Christ were not asylum seekers…

refugees photo

Photo by ResoluteSupportMedia (CC)

(Joe Simonson, Daily Caller News Foundation) It’s Christmas time, which for most people means spending time with family — unless you’re a contributor to the New York Times — in which case the holiday season is a perfect time to elicit sympathy for open borders for Middle Eastern refugees.

In “Where Jesus Would Spend Christmas,” Stephanie Saldaña draws comparisons with the plight of displaced families in the Greek refugee camp of Moria to the birth of Jesus Christ.

“As we live through the largest migration in modern history, Christmas invites us to recognize our story in the millions who have been displaced by tyrants, war and poverty and to see their stories in ours,” she writes.

Of course, Christmas is certainly a time to reflect on the most needy in society, but stating that “Moria is Bethlehem” is a bit of a stretch considering millions of Christians are celebrating the birth of Jesus, not just two parents who fell on hard times.

** MORE NY TIMES COVERAGE at Liberty Headlines **

Although Saldaña’s description of the filthy conditions of the camp deserve sympathy, she can’t help but accidently demonstrate just how muddled the refugee situation has become.

For example, she cites one young man (a large majority of asylum seekers from the last two years are men, leading to questions about whether many are simply taking advantage of Europe’s economy and generous welfare benefits, rather than fleeing war) from Gaza.

Unlike Syria or Iraq, Gaza has remained completely untouched from Bashar al-Assad or ISIS’s terror. Many of the hardships experienced by Palestinians can be attributed to their democratically-elected government’s unwillingness to cooperate with Israel in rooting out terrorism. Despite strict monitoring by the Israeli government, Palestinians enjoy a better quality of life on average than most Middle Eastern countries.

While Saldaña tells us that Moria “can also teach us about what Christmas really is” because of the supposed similarities between the conditions of refugees and Mary and Joseph, it’s important to note that the parents of Christ were not asylum seekers. Instead, they were returning home because of a government-mandated census by Caesar Augustus.

Thus, when she writes “if we want to imagine the Nativity, we needn’t go farther than the tent of Alaa Adin from Syria,” Saldaña is doing a disservice to her readers. Comparing the waits in a refugee camp to how Mary and Joseph’s lives were “upended for a census” is fallacious considering Mary and Joseph were returning home, not to a new country.

Republished with permission from the Daily Caller News Foundation via iCopyright license

  • Diana Sloan

    MORE LIES…THE HORDE OF YOUNG SINGLE MUSLIM FIGHTING MEN DOES NOT EVEN COME CLOSE TO THE CHRISTIAN’S HOLY FAMILY !

    • Jackalyn Morrison

      AMEN

    • AKLady

      Everyone in the United States is either an immigrant or the descendent of an immigrant — even thw First People. Islam has been part of our country since before we were a Nation.

      • Bimu

        I don’t see to many Free Mason Muslim’s ? Why is that ?

        • AKLady

          Your don’t see many Free Mason Catholics?
          Why is that?
          The Judeo-Masonic Conspiracy is by far the most popular of conspiracy theories to survive over the centuries.

  • Roy Veteto

    the irony of these asylum seekers is that they don’t come in peace [wiseman] but wait for an opportunity to kill [like herod did to the babies in bethlehem]

    • Bill Fortune

      So the question is, what are yo-all going to do about it ??? If the Republicans said that they will quit the military, the Libs will fall to their knees. “We have no country when the good go to war and get wasted, while the wasted stay home and breed” !

      • CHARLES S

        May I ask you what you are doing, sir??? As for myself, I keep calling my governor and my senators complaining about the ‘refugee resettlement programs’ (who are nothing more the pimps collecting “blood money” for the sole purpose of bringing in radical and devote Muslims who have no intention of assimilating). Lately these radical Muslims want ‘us’ to kowtow to their demands and their way of life. For them, its as though the U S is their country and WE are the ones that must bend over to accommodate them! I am continually on the phone talking to my politicians about illegal immigration, chain migration, emailing Pres. Trump about my concerns and about the safety of our country (regarding the refugee programs and the lack of proper vetting on these refugees/criminal illegals crossing our border),etc. I have called my governor and senators (without any answers–but I never give up)as to why most of the refugees are NEVER resettled in their ‘gated communities or around their personal residence.”….and of course I get NO response; but I keep it up… I am not a quitter.

        • libsrtheh8ters

          The fact of the matter is that we have ZERO input, our “representatives” never hear nor see our complaints or praises, their staff deal with us. They are WAY too busy groveling to the leftist globalist billionaires for cash.

          • AKLady

            You elect Congress.
            Maybe you should pick better people to vote for.

          • Roy Veteto

            you say that not all muslims are terrorists, but of all the muslim based groups that i can think of [isis , taliban , al qaida, boko haram, al shabab] they all are alike in that they hate non muslims and support death in all forms. w3henever a muslim based terrorist act happens i never hear of a muslim group that rushes to help the victims. i will choose to be a ham loving infidel over a hateful muslim. as a matter of fact there have been imams encouraging a war on christmas and denying jesus [even though according to the muslim faith jesus is a prophet].

          • ALL religions foment religious terrorism!

          • Bimu

            You should read or reread the Beatitudes, the Sermon on the Mount – just for starters.

          • Kathryn Jordan

            I agree with you about that when it comes to Buzz Waldron. I will say that I think we all could us a refresher course in the Beatitudes from the Sermon on the Mount.

          • 99% of DAILY Religious Terrorism in the USA is Christian Religious Terrorism !!! :

            Footnoted small sample of Judeo/Christian Religious Terrorism WRITTEN ORDERS direct from the Christian BuyBull (Quran has even more) for Murdering of innocent people:

            “Blessed be the Lord my Rock, who trains my hands for WAR, my fingers for BATTLE.” Psalm 144:1.

            Jesus: “ Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a SWORD. 35 For I have come to turn…
            “a man against his father,
            a daughter against her mother,
            a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law…” Mathew10:34-35

            Jesus, who wanted to be King of the Jews, said: “But those enemies of mine who did not want me to be king over them–bring them here and KILL them in front of me.” (Luke 19:27)

            Anyone who curses or blasphemes God, should be STONED TO DEATH by the community. (Leviticus 24:14-16)

            Anyone who dreams or prophesizes anything that is against God, or anyone who tries to turn you from God, is to be PUT TO DEATH. (Deuteronomy 13:5)

            If anyone, even your own family suggests worshipping another God, KILL them. (Deuteronomy 13:6-10)

            If you find out a city worships a different god, destroy the city and KILL ALL of it’s inhabitants… even the animals. (Deuteronomy 13:12-15)

            KILL anyone with a different religion. (Deuteronomy 17:2-7)

            KILL all men, women, children, and, even, babies already of the 20 nations/50 belief systems/religions of the Promised Land when moving into it. (Deuteronomy)

            Imaginary Jesus of gospel stories said his followers must obey the Torah/Old Testament (N.T. not invented yet) (Jesus invented ~150 A.D.)

          • Kathryn Jordan

            The Torah/Old Testament writings were written for a time when “stoning to death” was correct at that time. I believe in the New Testament and the teachings of Jesus. Most of what you quoted from the Old Testament was for that time. Do we “STONE” people to death for blasphemes God? commits adultery? Do we kill people with a different religion? DOES THIS HAPPEN HERE IN THE UNITED STATES? Answer: NO. The quote from Luke 19:27 is from the parable of Sums of Money.

          • You should read your whole evil BuyBull !!!

            99% of DAILY Religious Terrorism in the USA is Christian Religious Terrorism !!! :

            Footnoted small sample of Judeo/Christian Religious Terrorism WRITTEN ORDERS direct from the Christian BuyBull (Quran has even more) for Murdering of innocent people:

            “Blessed be the Lord my Rock, who trains my hands for WAR, my fingers for BATTLE.” Psalm 144:1.

            Jesus: “ Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a SWORD. 35 For I have come to turn…
            “a man against his father,
            a daughter against her mother,
            a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law…” Mathew10:34-35

            Jesus, who wanted to be King of the Jews, said: “But those enemies of mine who did not want me to be king over them–bring them here and KILL them in front of me.” (Luke 19:27)

            Anyone who curses or blasphemes God, should be STONED TO DEATH by the community. (Leviticus 24:14-16)

            Anyone who dreams or prophesizes anything that is against God, or anyone who tries to turn you from God, is to be PUT TO DEATH. (Deuteronomy 13:5)

            If anyone, even your own family suggests worshipping another God, KILL them. (Deuteronomy 13:6-10)

            If you find out a city worships a different god, destroy the city and KILL ALL of it’s inhabitants… even the animals. (Deuteronomy 13:12-15)

            KILL anyone with a different religion. (Deuteronomy 17:2-7)

            KILL all men, women, children, and, even, babies already of the 20 nations/50 belief systems/religions of the Promised Land when moving into it. (Deuteronomy)

            Imaginary Jesus of gospel stories said his followers must obey the Torah/Old Testament (N.T. not invented yet) (Jesus invented ~150 A.D.)

          • Bimu

            So then, when your ‘neighbor’ invades your yard, enters through the doors of your home and into the rooms of that house to seek you and your blood and kin, shall you lay down like sheep and if you survive do you not remember ?

          • Bimu

            You pick and choose and then don’t even contextualize well at all. Luke 19:27, Jesus was telling a parable and the “quote” you use were words Jesus spoke as the ‘person of the nobleman who wanted to be king’ and his judgement upon his servants as to how they handled the money he had given them to further enrich himself.
            Matthew 10: 34-35 I’m going to assume you are aware of conflict within family and Jesus came to share the Light of Truth and to war against evil and darkness, between himself and the Antichrist as well as Satan himself. As such, those who choose to follow him will be at odds with those who don’t.
            Deuteronomy 13:5 There are 57 words to this verse in the NIV translation and you choose to use 25 and you didn’t even present them in the order of usage as originally written and by leaving out the purpose behind the order of obedience you shift its meaning to fit your own misleading reason. Maybe you should edit for the NY Times or CNN television.

            I don’t care to go on at this time but I will pray for you in the hope your hatred, which Jesus related to murder will diminish and that the fruit of the Spirit continue to do a mighty work. Be Well !

          • Kathryn Jordan

            The ones you listed (isis, taliban, al quida, etc) are radical Muslim terrorists. They have taken their faith to such an extreme that it is violent and not peaceful. Jesus is one of the five elite prophets to the Muslim faith.

          • Bella Gray

            Keep dreaming, all Muslims worship the same sh💩t. The Quran teaches them they are superior to everyone else, even through their constant inbreeding has permanently damaged their genes. They are forbidden to assimilate. They are to live in peace until their numbers are hgh enough to attack eveyone and force everyone under the evil yoke of Islam. Until then they are to infiltrate every avenue they can that will gain them comtrol of our laws and us. They are doing that right now. They have a five to one birth rate. You do the math on that. We either find a way to rid our country of everyone of them or we go to war on our homeland. It is only a matter of time. The longer we wait the more we have to fight.

          • Bimu

            SO ? A prophet does not a Messiah make ?

            And yes it is hard to control everyone in such a large and varied groups and sects but I see very, very little effort to curb the “radicals”.

          • Kathryn Jordan

            In the Muslim faith. In the Christian faith, Jesus is the Messiah. We are taught that. The Jews do not believe that Jews is not the Messiah; they believe he is a prophet through. Suggest you take a class in religious education. maybe you might learn something.

          • Bimu

            I never said the Jews, of old or modern Orthodox, think that Jesus is the Messiah. The Bible makes it very clear the Sadducees and the Pharisees detested Jesus claim as the Son of God. I’m no theologian but don’t bark up the wrong tree. I’m sure of my salvation and I’m sure that the Christian Jews of modern days feel the same.

            As far as the Muslims I’m not aware that they worship Jesus as the Messiah. That’s news to me !

          • AKLady

            Muslims worship the Old Testament God of Abraham.
            They consider Jesus to be a significant prophet.
            The Koran contains an entire chapter dedicated to His mother, Mary.

          • Bimu

            Nothing new there. Whooppee………..AS I SAID BEFORE, a prophet does not a Messiah make !!!
            Perhaps they could dedicate some ‘love’ to the Beatitudes or the complete Sermon or to the wisdom of the parables or to just not killing each other and those who live otherwise than to the political system that Islam is. It is as much political as it is ‘religious’.

          • AKLady

            Only Christians hold Christ out as the Messiah. Jews and Muslims count the dots and say he comes up short on a couple requirements. In my book. religion is a business, a very profitable business. I only know of three or four recognized sects that are not in the “money” business. The Roman Catholic Church is the wealthiest of the group.
            .
            As a physician, the burning of healers at the stake is a real turn off for me. Most of then were women, although there were a few men. Then, Christianity was very good at thinking up painful ways to kill people. The Catholic Church was the master killer.

          • Bimu

            Abraham = father Isaac = son of Abraham and of the Hebrew people Ishmael = son of Abraham and of the Arab/Muslim people. Two brothers (half-brothers) and the conflict has remained for thousands of years. Family has always been difficult and today’s conflicts and ill will are only an extension of that long history. It’s all in the Bible – quite the Book, it is !

          • AKLady

            I have an extensive religious education, my husband and I taught
            S, Baptist Sunday school. However, the current animosity has more to do with the world’s land-grab and gifting to the Jews. Had the Middle Eastern countries not sided with the Germans in WW II, they would not have been hit quite so hard.
            In addition to the mythology, the Bible holds a great deal of history. To date, much of that history has been proven factual, and fairly accurate, Well, at least the Old Testament. Genesis is based on pre-existing pagan creation stories, mostly Babylonian.

          • AKLady

            Dear Roy, Islam is the second largest of the world’s religions. Contrary to your belief, they all do not live in the Middle East. In fact the majority of Muslims are in theAsian and the Pacific nations.

          • AKLady

            Oh, you forgot to mention that the Koran contains an entire chapter dedicated to Mary, mother of Jesus. Yes, they do recognize Jesus as a great prophet. You see, to think the world is Christian …

          • Bimu

            So why the hatred if the admiration is so great ?

          • AKLady

            Hatred? I suggest you review the history of the Middle East.
            How the area was kept a third-world by Western occupiers…How their minerals were basically stolen …
            How their religious beliefs were condemned — still are, for that matter.
            .
            You hear Muslim this, Muslim that, but never any mention of the country, or actual political group … You sir, are guilty of that brand of religious bigotry — you just published it for the world to see.

          • Bimu

            The Jewish folks have been suppressed far more dear lady. If Islam came not until 7th century AD and the Hebrew “nation” since the “beginning” time and numbers, time and numbers. And those western occupiers, you mean Alexander and the Caesar’s and the Assyrians, to name a few, and we can go on. That occurred long before any British invasion.

          • AKLady

            Oh, I see, Jews were suppressed and treated unfairly, therefore it is acceptable to for the same to be done to Muslims.

            How about following WW I and WW II? Lets talk about factual British and French imperialism. Lets consider the effects of the mandate system on the Arab part of the Ottoman Empire …

            How about the 1947 United Nations plan to partition Palestine? Cold War tensions seemingly gave rise to the Arabic-speaking countries of Western Asia and Northern Africa rise of pan-Arabism.

          • ALL religions are evil mental illness… ALL religions foment evil murderous religious terrorism…
            99% of DAILY Religious Terrorism in the USA is Christian Religious Terrorism !!! :

            Footnoted small sample of Judeo/Christian Religious Terrorism WRITTEN ORDERS direct from the Christian BuyBull (Quran has even more) for Murdering of innocent people:

            “Blessed be the Lord my Rock, who trains my hands for WAR, my fingers for BATTLE.” Psalm 144:1.

            Jesus: “ Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a SWORD. 35 For I have come to turn…
            “a man against his father,
            a daughter against her mother,
            a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law…” Mathew10:34-35

            Jesus, who wanted to be King of the Jews, said: “But those enemies of mine who did not want me to be king over them–bring them here and KILL them in front of me.” (Luke 19:27)

            Anyone who curses or blasphemes God, should be STONED TO DEATH by the community. (Leviticus 24:14-16)

            Anyone who dreams or prophesizes anything that is against God, or anyone who tries to turn you from God, is to be PUT TO DEATH. (Deuteronomy 13:5)

            If anyone, even your own family suggests worshipping another God, KILL them. (Deuteronomy 13:6-10)

            If you find out a city worships a different god, destroy the city and KILL ALL of it’s inhabitants… even the animals. (Deuteronomy 13:12-15)

            KILL anyone with a different religion. (Deuteronomy 17:2-7)

            KILL all men, women, children, and, even, babies already of the 20 nations/50 belief systems/religions of the Promised Land when moving into it. (Deuteronomy)

            Imaginary Jesus of gospel stories said his followers must obey the Torah/Old Testament (N.T. not invented yet) (Jesus invented ~150 A.D.)

          • Learn: 99% of DAILY Religious Terrorism in the USA is Christian Religious Terrorism !!! :

            Footnoted small sample of Judeo/Christian Religious Terrorism WRITTEN ORDERS direct from the Christian BuyBull (Quran has even more) for Murdering of innocent people:

            “Blessed be the Lord my Rock, who trains my hands for WAR, my fingers for BATTLE.” Psalm 144:1.

            Jesus: “ Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a SWORD. 35 For I have come to turn…
            “a man against his father,
            a daughter against her mother,
            a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law…” Mathew10:34-35

            Jesus, who wanted to be King of the Jews, said: “But those enemies of mine who did not want me to be king over them–bring them here and KILL them in front of me.” (Luke 19:27)

            Anyone who curses or blasphemes God, should be STONED TO DEATH by the community. (Leviticus 24:14-16)

            Anyone who dreams or prophesizes anything that is against God, or anyone who tries to turn you from God, is to be PUT TO DEATH. (Deuteronomy 13:5)

            If anyone, even your own family suggests worshipping another God, KILL them. (Deuteronomy 13:6-10)

            If you find out a city worships a different god, destroy the city and KILL ALL of it’s inhabitants… even the animals. (Deuteronomy 13:12-15)

            KILL anyone with a different religion. (Deuteronomy 17:2-7)

            KILL all men, women, children, and, even, babies already of the 20 nations/50 belief systems/religions of the Promised Land when moving into it. (Deuteronomy)

            Imaginary Jesus of gospel stories said his followers must obey the Torah/Old Testament (N.T. not invented yet) (Jesus invented ~150 A.D.)

          • Yep, Muslims just as evil as Christians… identical…
            99% of DAILY Religious Terrorism in the USA is Christian Religious Terrorism !!! :

            Footnoted small sample of Judeo/Christian Religious Terrorism WRITTEN ORDERS direct from the Christian BuyBull (Quran has even more) for Murdering of innocent people:

            “Blessed be the Lord my Rock, who trains my hands for WAR, my fingers for BATTLE.” Psalm 144:1.

            Jesus: “ Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a SWORD. 35 For I have come to turn…
            “a man against his father,
            a daughter against her mother,
            a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law…” Mathew10:34-35

            Jesus, who wanted to be King of the Jews, said: “But those enemies of mine who did not want me to be king over them–bring them here and KILL them in front of me.” (Luke 19:27)

            Anyone who curses or blasphemes God, should be STONED TO DEATH by the community. (Leviticus 24:14-16)

            Anyone who dreams or prophesizes anything that is against God, or anyone who tries to turn you from God, is to be PUT TO DEATH. (Deuteronomy 13:5)

            If anyone, even your own family suggests worshipping another God, KILL them. (Deuteronomy 13:6-10)

            If you find out a city worships a different god, destroy the city and KILL ALL of it’s inhabitants… even the animals. (Deuteronomy 13:12-15)

            KILL anyone with a different religion. (Deuteronomy 17:2-7)

            KILL all men, women, children, and, even, babies already of the 20 nations/50 belief systems/religions of the Promised Land when moving into it. (Deuteronomy)

            Imaginary Jesus of gospel stories said his followers must obey the Torah/Old Testament (N.T. not invented yet) (Jesus invented ~150 A.D.)

          • AKLady

            All religion teaches hate.

          • What’s that you say?

            We have. Where have you been the last year?

          • She’s probably taking a nap under her favorite rock.

          • What’s that you say?

            Or Ice cube

          • AKLady

            The people of 1929-1945 Germany thought the same way …

          • What’s that you say?

            And the liberals of this century have killed more babies than Hitler killed Jews. What’s your defense of that?

          • AKLady

            Zygotes are not babies.
            Abortion is not “killing”.
            Suggest you look up the “characteristics” that define “life”.

          • Bimu

            By those standards we have little to discuss. We have little in common about life, respect for humanity, in it’s various stages of “being”. How long does your “primordial soup” have to exist before you consider it life. I suppose those were dead eggs and dead sperm or were they just dormant ? Why would it be necessary for the menstrual cycle but to dispose of what was alive but is no more ? Death is life or death is part of the life cycle…you can justify your science in your mind but not within my own.

          • AKLady

            You wash thousands of zygote equivalents down the drain every tine you take a bath … Maybe you should stop bathing!

          • Bimu

            Maybe but doubtful. Equivalents – WOW ! Equivalents – very scientific. Too bad you can’t substitute an equivalent and make life.

          • AKLady

            Scientists created the first synthetic bacterium in 2010.
            You are a bit behind the times.

          • Bimu

            …and abortion has existed since the beginning ? Your point being – death and evil are still death and evil by many other names ?

          • AKLady

            Evil is defined by the society/culture in which you reside.
            Religion is an additional layer of power and control.

          • Bimu

            God gave us free will – to choose to or to choose not. If you feel guilt, shame or embarrassment – welcome to humanity and the emotions thereof.
            I do believe the Scriptures reference “freedom” [or the lack of (sinfulness)] as does the Declaration of Independence having been from God, the Creator of our inalienable rights….those darn traitors just couldn’t get it right. They never did like being led by the nose or the pocketbook or by all the King’s men. In all their imperfections, we have been blessed and are able to be forgiven. That applies to everyone if you believe you can or should.

          • AKLady

            You are spouting “religion”.
            It is a form of discrimination.
            God does not discriminate.
            God does not care what name or names you call Him or Her.
            Evil and/or sin is defined by the society/culture you live in.
            Teachings most Christians seem to intentionally forget is:
            Judge not, least thee be judged … and found wanting.
            .
            I suggest you learn to respect all belief systems .. God does.
            The name or names you call Him do not matter.
            It does not matter if you think he ins one or many.
            What matters is that you recognize the existence of a Supreme being.
            What matters is that you recognize we are all created in his image and likeness. (Genesis 1:26).

          • Bimu

            There is but one God ! Certainly you have heard of blasphemy so the name you give Him does matter and the reverence you show is important. The teachings are many and not any one is more important than any other. except that you believe that Jesus is the Son of God. Jesus came not to fulfill the law but to save one from the law.

          • AKLady

            Blasphemy is religion dependent.
            What is blasphemy in one, is not blasphemy in another.
            You are spewing religion.
            You are spewing disrespect for the beliefs of others.
            You are claiming your religion is better than other religions.
            We are all God’s children, so sayth the Christian Bible …
            Religion was created by man, for the control of man.

          • Bimu

            I believe it is you who are spewing !
            Just because there are different beliefs does not mean there must be hatred and disrespect. I respect someone’s right to believe whatever they want and we will let the eternal be in the realm and hands of the Ancient of Old. You can’t pick and choose and then contextualize the Bible. That is not wise and the Scripture says that wisdom is from God. I am not in the control business, I do espouse the fruits of the Spirit, our Counselor, as to how we ought to interact with all the children of the Creator. He is the Judge, not I !

          • Kathryn Jordan

            God will eventually judge us. We are told NOT to judge lest we be judged; for in the manner we judge, will be measured back to us (in the same fashion from God). We are ALL God’s children. God does not deny anyone on the basis of religion, race, creed, etc.

          • AKLady

            Christ came “…not to abolish, but to fulfill.” Matthew 5:17

          • Bimu

            He fulfilled prophecy concerning His being.

          • What’s that you say?

            You are the devil reading scripture.

          • What’s that you say?

            Do not use God’s name in vain. You are a terrible person.

          • What’s that you say?

            Maybe your mother should have washed you down the drain. What a sweet daughter you have become. Your father would throw up hearing you.

          • AKLady

            Both my parents were physicians.
            Both were well-educated and quite liberal.
            You are about as wrong as one can get.

          • What’s that you say?

            You are all baby killers in God’s eye. There are no excuses that will save your wretched souls.

          • AKLady

            Suggest you read the Bible.
            The Old Testament is rife with abortion.

            In fact, according to the Bible, an infant has no value until age one month, And if it be from a month old even unto five years old, then thy estimation shall be of the male five shekels of silver, and for the female thy estimation shall be three shekels of silver.

            Exodus 21:22–24 speaks to abortion. Numbers 5:11-31does also.
            Then Christianity came alone, made women chattel, slaves and baby factories.

          • AKLady

            Both my parents were physicians.
            Both were well-educated and quite liberal.
            You are about as wrong as one can get.

          • doc suske

            obviously, you have (you are already brain-washed)

          • AKLady

            Take a biology class. What is your doctorate in, anyway?

          • Col C

            Don’t waste your time with aka lady, she denies the truth when it’s smacking her in the face through ultrasound and intrauterine photography. Babies at 8 weeks have fingers and toes, and arms and legs, and a heartbeat, and most suction abortions are not done that early, most are at 10 weeks, and the baby is even more developed,

          • AKLady

            There were neither sperm or ova in the primordial soup.
            It was all chemicals.
            Your body is made of chemicals.

          • What’s that you say?

            You are sick.

          • AKLady

            Science is neither liberal nor conservative, simply factual.

          • What’s that you say?

            Killing the unborn is a choice.

          • AKLady

            “Unborn” is emotional game playing.
            A fetus become a child when it can survive outside of the womb.

          • AKLady

            Judged by you …
            Suggest you read the bible.
            The Bible places no value on an infant until one year.
            Judged by God? Which God: yours, theirs, mine…?
            Catholic Ireland’s law was so strict mother and child were allowed to die.
            Is that what you demand?
            First you demand poor women not be provided birth control.
            Then you come demanding abortion be outlawed.
            Then, your type turns around and say Muslim women are treated badly …
            .
            MIND YOUR OWN BUSINESS. Your life will be much happier

          • What’s that you say?

            Go away baby killer.
            You will be judged not by me but by a higher power.
            Keep talking yourself into feeling it’s all right to kill a human life. On your death bed you will KNOW.

          • AKLady

            Name-calling is nursery school behavior.
            Apparently, you are not aware that some birth control medications work by preventing a fertilized cell from implanting in the uterus wall.
            Amazing, how the “religion of love” threatens people.
            Christianity is not a great deal different from Islam, or a least in the maner it is practiced by some people …
            Your threats make an impression. Just not the one you desire. Your posts make me think of the days when they stoned and burned people to death.

          • What’s that you say?

            It’s your life. You made all your own decisions. Everyone has to live with their decisions. You have made yours. You can change your thinking but that is up to you.
            I am simply pointing out that killing unborn children is morally apprehensive to me.

          • AKLady

            Zygotes are not children.
            You wash equivalent cells down the drain,
            by the thousands, every time you take a bath.

          • What’s that you say?

            Sad. Sane response as before. There is no hope for you,

          • AKLady

            Maybe you should stop bathing.
            You are murdering living cells.

          • What’s that you say?

            You are a cell that turned into a sociopath.

          • AKLady

            The bottom line is, insults only hurt when they come from someone I respect. I’ll let you know when, and if, you ever qualify.

          • What’s that you say?

            I could care less what you think. You seem to keep becoming back to me looking for redemption or forgiveness. Why don’t you just leave me alone and move on with your immoral life? I can’t help you.

          • AKLady

            You embarrass America with your ignorance.
            You are the one in need of help.

          • What’s that you say?

            Ha, ha, ha embarrassing myself? I am calling you out and every time you make a comment on this conservative site with anyone, I will call you out for what you are baby killer.
            You are a murdering abortionist and every time I get the opportunity I will call you out. Get it? Now get lost.

          • AKLady

            You are simply ignorant and rude.
            You also make assumptions.
            You are a liar and an insulter.

          • What’s that you say?

            Good bye baby killer

          • AKLady

            You are simply ignorant and rude.
            You also make assumptions.
            You are a liar and an insulter.

          • What’s that you say?

            Good bye baby killer

          • doc suske

            Yes, but developed embryos ARE babies – fully formed, live humans. Ending that life is murder/killing.

          • AKLady

            Sorry, if they cannot survive outside of the womb, they ate not “babies”.

          • doc suske

            OK, how about the live births that are killed by PP? (For baby parts)

          • AKLady

            Why do you lie?
            Why do you repeat lies?

          • Bimu

            The people or the leadership ?

          • AKLady

            Who elected the leadership?
            Get real …
            Try some educarion, it will do wonders for you.

          • Bimu

            Ask the leadership because delegates aren’t just the regular populace. They have their contacts. Perhaps you should read of Clinton’s conquest of the leadership of memes.

          • AKLady

            del·e·gate
            noun
            plural noun: delegates
            ˈdeləɡət/
            1.
            a person sent or authorized to represent others, in particular an elected representative sent to a conference.

          • Bimu

            Thus, a democracy the United States is not yet we are represented. We have neither a strict, direct democracy nor a representative democracy but a republic that has democratic principles in use.

          • AKLady

            The U.S. is a republic which practices representative democracy.

          • What’s that you say?

            Which we excercised last November.

          • AKLady

            Really?
            We the People elected Hillary.
            The Electoral College put Trump on office.
            .
            Please explain how that equates to representative democracy?
            Tell us exactly who was being represented?

          • What’s that you say?

            Thank God for the electoral college. The founding fathers knew. This is the United States of America not the people of California NewYork.
            Get over it.

          • AKLady

            The Electoral College was developed due to distance and travel time.
            I had nothing to do with the “modern” claims being made.
            The Electors are sworn to vote as the people have voted.
            However, only Maine and Nebraska apportion their Electoral votes to that of the people. The Electoral College makes it so much easier for a cheat like Trump to buy an election. The truth in coming out, little-by-little. I expect to see the Trump Presidency end with him in Leavenworth, if not executed for treason.

          • What’s that you say?

            That is not true. Get your history right. It was set up so that a few states with high populations would not be able to take control of the union from the sparsely populated states. At that time it was Virginia and New York. It just happens to be New York, Massachusetts and California today.
            Do think it’s fair that Alaska has two Senators just like California? I bet you won’t want to give up your two. They were way ahead of you liberals.
            Name one law that President Trump has violated. You are so full of fake BS you don’t even realize it.

          • What’s that you say?

            And the liberals of this century killed more babies than Hitler killed Jews.
            What is your defense of that?

          • Bella Gray

            She is a Muslim, enough said.

          • AKLady

            Islam is the world’s second largest religion.
            Why do you think you have the right to insult almost 2 billion people?

          • What’s that you say?

            We are Americans. We have a right to free speech.?

          • What’s that you say?

            You are right!

          • AKLady

            Actually, I was born and raised Roman Catholic.
            Later in life, I became a Southern Baptist.
            Now, I am like Jefferson , an agnostic.

          • AKLady

            Is that supposed to be an insult?
            Obviously, you do not fact check a single thing that comes out of Trump’s mouth. The man’s lies are legion.

          • Bimu

            legion or legend ? ? ?

          • AKLady

            le·gion
            ˈlējən/
            noun
            noun: legion; plural noun: legions
            1. a unit of 3,000–6,000 men in the ancient Roman army.
            2. a vast host, multitude, or number of people or things.

          • Bimu

            That is an odd or perhaps, unique, description of his lies. I will assume since legion(s) is a noun you infer he has lied 3 to 6 thousand times.

          • AKLady

            Suggest you skip to #2: vast number of things (lies).
            More than most politicians …

          • Bimu

            So if I skip #2, how does number one have any meaning in reference to the President ?

          • doc suske

            And your facts are??

          • AKLady

            At every reliable source on the internet.

          • doc suske

            Which are? CNN, NYT, Wash Post, NBC?? Just what do
            YOU consider reliable?

          • AKLady

            None you have listed.

          • doc suske

            Same question– WHAT ARE your sources for facts? You don’t seem to want to answer?

          • AKLady

            Do a search. I use whatever VALID sources come up. There are many. I do not rely upon just one or two.

          • doc suske

            Thanks for responding so quickly- but, you still haven’t answered a simple question- what are YOUR “valid” sources? From what search engine?
            Just name a few, please.

          • AKLady

            I told you exactly how it is done.
            I do not use any “set” sources.
            I choose the best for the issue/question
            BBC, MIT, Harvard, NIH. Mayo,,,,

          • doc suske

            O K so those are the sites you use to document Jesus birth & the families status as “immigrants”?
            I wanted to know, as that’s obviously BS.
            Have a Happy New Year
            & help Trump MAGA!

          • AKLady

            Actually. there is historic research into the existence of Jesus.
            For one thing, he would have been born in a warm month …
            But, you see, the early Catholic Church used existing pagan holidays to create “holy” day. Christmas is the pagan festival of lights.

            Which family’s status as immigrants?
            Joseph and Mary were travelers, not immigrants.

          • doc suske

            I don’t think anyone disputes when he was born, nor why we celebrate on a Pagan holiday, but, you still do not defend your opinions based on “facts” from “reliable” sources?.
            & I guess you agree with the whole premise of this discussion- that they were NOT immigrants *& how they were treated, has no bearing on our current illegal immigrant & refuge problems?
            Thanks

          • What’s that you say?

            Is that suppose to be an answer?
            Tell me what lies you are talking about.

          • doc suske

            Trump may not be the most eloquent- & therefore what he says may be interpreted wrongly, but, in the long run, his claims have been shown to be true (after being made fun of, & declared false by the MSM) MANY times.

          • AKLady

            You mean loke “Just grab them by the pu$$y”?

          • doc suske

            Yes, a male “joke” 30 yrs ago- I suppose you never used the term? Nor called a male organ by another name? Besides, sayin’ it ain’t the same as doin’ it.

          • Kathryn Jordan

            They probably don’t have “better people” to pick from so they can be proud to vote.

          • Kathryn Jordan

            You are so right. We do elect Congress. I guess Bill Fortune doesn’t know how to pick better people to vote for. I am not even sure if “What’s that you say?” even knows the answer to that.

          • AKLady

            Many Americans can no longer be bothered to vote.
            They have been well-brainwashed into believing that voting dies not matter. That is basically true in Presidential elections, but not in those regarding state and local candidates, including Congress and the Senate.

          • What’s that you say?

            Do us all a favor and stop voting.

          • Kathryn Jordan

            Part of the problem is Republican gerrymandering, low voter turnout. Some of the younger generation didn’t turn out in last years Presidential election. People need to get out and vote in Presidential, State and local elections.

          • AKLady

            Quite true. Gerrymandering seems about the only way Republicans can win an election.

          • Bimu

            You two deserve each other. Go get on a selection committee or at least keep your write-in pen handy.

          • Bill Fortune

            Right on ! Again, the only way I see is to get the Republicans to quit the military.

        • AKLady

          Islam has been part of Americxa since before we became a nation. We brought millions of Muslims here in chains, sold them like property, and worked them like beasts of burden.

          • Alibaba

            Looks like we didn’t do it enough, or we did it to the wrong people! Those brought in chains are already Christians and don’t even think about became muslims again, while those who sold them to us, looks like they want them back, and us dead!

          • AKLady

            The very basis of this country’s existence is religious freedom. We are not now, nor have we ever been a Christian country. Our Founders made that very clear.

          • Bimu

            To say you are a Christian nation is not the same as saying you are a nation of Christians ! To say you are a Christian nation implies that there is a national religion or a state sponsored and controlled religion ! Our Founder’s made that very clear !

          • AKLady

            America is neither a Christian nation nor an nation of Christians.
            It never has been, it never will be.

          • AKLady

            The US is neither a Christian nation nor a nation of Christians. We never have been.

          • tasharina1

            Our founders did not make the Christian religion the religion of America, because Christianity is not a religion. What they did though, was use Christian theological doctrines in forming the Constitution, the Bill of Rights and laws based on those precepts. So, the entire conception of America was Christian, except for the Ten Commandments, which is Judeo and included in the Christian Bible and teachings. But not as a religion though, because there are many religions who call themselves Christian, who follow Christian ideology as they choose to practice it, such as Lutheran, Baptist, Catholic, etc.

          • AKLady

            “But how has it happened that millions of fables, tales, legends, have been blended with both Jewish and Christian revelation that have made them the most bloody religion that ever existed.–John Adams in a letter to F.A. Van der Kamp, Dec. 27, 1816

            “The Government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian religion.”
            ~1797 Treaty of Tripoli signed by Founding Father John Adams

            “In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own. It is error alone that needs the support of government. Truth can stand by itself.”
            ~Founding Father Thomas Jefferson, in a letter to Horatio Spofford, 1814

            “And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in shewing that religion & Govt will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together.”
            ~Founding Father James Madison, letter to Edward Livingston, July 10, 1822

            “No religious doctrine shall be established by law.”
            ~Founding Father Elbridge Gerry, Annals of Congress 1:729-731

          • tasharina1

            Your still talking about religion and I am not. Christianity is a theology, not a religion. Even though religions have sprung up from that theology. That theology is what America was created upon.

          • AKLady

            the·ol·o·gy
            THēˈäləjē/
            noun
            noun: theology
            the study of the nature of God and RELIGIOUS BELIEF.

          • tasharina1

            Very few Muslims were brought to Americas as slaves. The vast majority were non Muslim Blacks and Irish. The main involvement with Islam and America, at that time, was in being slave traders and pirates.

          • Bimu

            History and facts should be the same “thing”. thank You Tasharina1 !

          • tasharina1

            Yes, I agree. But, unfortunately, there are some who are constantly trying to change the facts to fit their agenda and it is up to people like you and me to keep rebutting with the facts, so they can’t change them by constantly stating them unchallenged. Thank You Bimu!

          • Bimu

            It is for sure that just because you say something, over and over and over, that does not make it fact or an honest statement or a truthful effort…although that has become an apparent tactic in the modern political era. The Clinton clan really have tilted the democratic party with these type statements…but end the end, truth will prevail and the light will overcome the darkness.

          • tasharina1

            So true. I heard something that really made sense to me and will share it with you. The truth is always true, even if people don’t believe it and a lie is always a lie even if people do believe it.

          • Bimu

            I like that ‘saying’. I appreciate you ‘spreading’ the wealth of the truth. Thanks Again !!!

          • AKLady

            you have neither truth nor fact.
            You are spreading lies and disinformation.
            There is a huge difference between thousands of indentured servants and millions of enslaved Africans.
            .
            Catholics were markedly discriminated against in early America. In some areas of our country, they still are. As arw Jews and Blacks and Mormons, and …

            Whatever made you think that slaves could openly practice their religion?

          • Bimu

            Where were the millions sent ? There were not millions sent to these shores.

            There has been discrimination by mankind since the beginning but Scripture says God has no favorites. He loves us all. There has been hatred, domination, pride since the beginning as well but then…….

            I don’t condone these actions but they have been and they are what they are. You can fluff the pillow all day long but it’s still a pillow.

            You mean open practice like the modern Christians versus the cult of ISIS. Interesting they destroy the antiquities of their heritage.

          • AKLady

            The millions were spent to repair the seaport and the airport.
            Both were needed in order to bring in adequate amounts of food and materials.
            The millions were spent on food, materials, medicine and shipping …

          • Bimu

            What are you talking about ? What era of history ? How did we get from 16th/17th century slave trade and slavery to airports ?

          • tasharina1

            By the way, I got so deep into my conversation with Bimu that I forgot this was in your thread. So, this statement wasn’t aimed at you, it was in general. You do have a lot of information and truth, some of it is just out of context of what I was saying and from not understanding what I am saying because you came into the middle of a deep conversation that didn’t really involve you. So, I didn’t mean to insult you and apologize for that. Even if I wanted to insult you, it would be directly to you. I don’t believe in insulting people’s ideas and opinions, which is why I stood up for you. But, I’m glad you got involved because I have learned some things from you.

          • AKLady

            You did not insult me.
            You insulted America.
            You insulted those who were brought here in chains,
            who were bought and sold like property …
            You insulted the thousands who died in those chains, and were tossed over thw side, into the ocean — like so much trash.
            You insulted the millions who lost family members to slavery .
            You insulted those who watched their children sold before their eyes.

            Oh, yes, America is a country of Christians …

          • AKLady

            The Bible was written by man, for man.
            It has been used for great evil.

          • tasharina1

            People that do evil will always find a way to turn good things, especially ideas, into vehicles where they can enact their evil agendas. Thus, the masses are constantly being deceived and kept ignorant of what is really going on. That is until the internet, which is why the powers that be are in a panic right now.

          • AKLady

            I suppose the Internet publication that supports your opinion is what you accept as true …

          • tasharina1

            Nope, that must be what you do. If I am wrong, I want to know it, but someone has to have some good logical fact based information for me to base my opinion on it. So far, what I have mainly seen from you is a lot of emotion based opinions, tinged with some anger and maybe hatred. Plus you are all over the place and keep changing subjects, to throw your opponent off the truth instead of sticking with your argument.You appear to me to be someone who see’s herself as a victim and spend a lot of time arguing from that victimhood point of view. It makes me feel bad for you, because it will only bring you unhappiness and hold you back from reaching your potential. By the way. I am a Christian who does not belong to a religion.

          • AKLady

            Thank you. We’re all refreshed and challenged by your unique point of view.

          • tasharina1

            Thank you for the lively and informative debate. I did get some information from you, I wasn’t aware of. I am sending positive thoughts your way filled with happiness and success, in abundance.

          • Barry
          • AKLady

            Martin Luther the defrocked Catholic priest, excommunicated by the Pope.
            Martin Luther who started his own religion because he did not like Catholic dogma …
            Martin Luther who preached that faith, alone, would get your into heaven.

          • Bimu

            I guess that make Luther a traitor just like the Founder’s, huh ?

          • AKLady

            Do you deny that the Founders were British subjects?
            Do you deny the Founders turned against the King?
            What is an America “hero” is a British “criminal”.

            Do you deny Luther was a Catholic priest?’
            Do you deny he turned ageist the Pope and the Catholic religion?

            Maybe you should try looking at issues as they can be seen by those outside of the US or your religious faith?
            .
            What it means iss that you need to learn that history has different facts depending upon which side you happen to be “on”.

          • Bimu

            You are sooooooo right and I am grateful for those for those who were brave enough to fight the darkness when the Light was before them.
            There will be many different denominations in Heaven but all of those individuals will believe that Jesus, the Christ, the Messiah, to be Immanuel, the Son of God, our Intercessor.

          • AKLady

            No, Bimu, they will not …
            They will be good people of all nationalities, walks of life, and religions.
            God does not care what name you call Him.
            Religion is a form of discrimination. God does not discriminate.

          • Bimu

            Oh yes there will…….but we share some agreement in that Jesus did not preach about religion and the respective rites and traditions and laws. He taught about relationships – that with God, the Father, and that with your fellow man, that being being is His image.
            “In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God.” Amen. ? .

          • AKLady

            Religion is a form of discrimination.
            God does not discriminate.
            Religion was created by man as a form of power and control.
            The Bible was written by man, as a form of power and control.
            All religion have a “Bible”.
            You simply claim that your religion is better than other religions ..
            Another form of man made control.

          • Bimu

            The Bible was penned by man as spoken by God to them. You can believe that or not but if one part or statement within the Bible is false then are the others not under suspicion as well ?

          • AKLady

            Every religion has a “bible” spoken to them by their “god”.
            Other than the mythology, they all say basically the same thing.
            Have you ever studied other religions?
            Probably not, as you have likely been taught to do so is sinful or some other such nonsense.

          • Kathryn Jordan

            In case you didn’t realize this, the “Light” has come into the world in the form of Jesus as an infant at Christmas. the light is here and now to overcome the darkness.

          • AKLady

            Jesus was not born in December.
            December 25th is the pagan celebration of returning light.
            It is basically the time of year when days begin to lengthen. In fact, if you bothered to do thw research, you would find that almost all Christian holy days are, in fact, pagan holidays.

          • Bimu

            It is very simple – you can choose to believe or not – but looking down your nose talking/writing as though you are superior, helps no one.

            There was a time when …..this thing called life has a way of changing people, some more than others.

          • AKLady

            Why do you see sharing factual information as “looking down your nose” ?
            .
            Why do you see sharing factual information as “talking/writing as though you are superior”.

          • Bimu

            You can choose to slant your info if you like. There are a myriad of explanations and if you read Scripture, the only “things” that truly matters is to believe in Him and to love another. Jesus did not preach religion or rites or traditions !

          • AKLady

            Faith alone will not get you through the gates of Heaven.

          • Bimu

            It certainly isn’t good works, good intentions or wishful thinking.
            “My peace I give to you,………”.

          • Kathryn Jordan

            Yeah. More than likely, Jesus was born in the Springtime. It was because of a certain pagan holiday (I forget which one it is) that came at winter time. I know that almost all Christian holy days are pagan holidays. I’ve learned that with talks with the rector of my parish in the Episcopal church.

          • Bimu

            The Holy Spirit of the Light is presently here. The Light is with His Father – “preparing rooms, interceding, readying for His return”………….

          • Barry

            As well, the devil attacks the true church every day, and he will not stop until the final return of Christ in His glory. Christmas is about the celebration of God’s incarnation and the sacrifice that He made to forgive us as sinners. In the meantime, we are to keep lifting High the cross and bearing the unchangeable, immovable truth and light of the Gospel so that those in darkness can see and repent and be forgiven for their sins. Merry Christmas tasharina1

          • AKLady

            We know that shepherds were in the fields watching their flocks at the time of Jesus’ birth. There were shepherds living out in the fields nearby, keeping watch over their flocks at night” (Luke 2:7-8). Shepherds were not in the fields during December.
            Satan is the Father of Lies …

          • AKLady

            Unfortunately, you do not have either facts or an adequate history education. You keep rebutting fact with nonsense.

          • tasharina1

            I responded to this in other replies to you. Man, I didn’t know you responded to me so many times and was wondering why. I forgot to refresh the notification page and missed all this fun of exchanging ideas and information.

          • AKLady

            Islam spread to Northern and Western Africa before the slave trade with America began in earnest. Slaves who attempted to practice their “traditional” religion were severely punished.
            .
            How do I know these things? I am the descendent of slave owners. I was born and raised in the Deep South. I went to school with grandchildren of slaves. I actually met two individuals who had been born into slavery, both were over 100 years old.

            My family had the purchase document for one of them. History, not something to be proud of or brag upon. Thankfully, some families kept those documents. The records were valuable when the individuals needed to file for delayed birth certificates, obtain SSNs and then file for SS Retirement.

          • AKLady

            There is a huge difference between indentured servitude and chattel slavery. You obviously confuse the two.

            Indentures servants numbered in the thousands.
            Millions of slaves were brought here from Africa.

            Unlike indentured servants, enslaved Africans generally were made slaves for life and slave status was imposed on their children at birth.[1]

          • Bimu

            I like the way you reply and then edit with significant changes. Impressive, a bit underhanded and misleading, but impressive for those who are impressed by slight of hand.

          • AKLady

            What in the world are you babbling about?
            Are you complaining about the way I write?

          • tasharina1

            It doesn’t matter what you call it, slavery is slavery whether it’s indentured or not. If it is forced against a person’s will it is all the same thing. But, as I said earlier to you, that the Irish were treated much worse than the Blacks. You should study up on the Irish slaves. And yes for a while all slaves were indentured, until a black indentured servant got his own land and his own indentured servant, which he kept as a slave instead of honoring the indentured rules. His name was Anthony Johnson and he was the first slave owner in America by going to court and getting slavery made legal.

          • AKLady

            Suggest you obtain a better history education.

            At the time of slavery, Islam was a primary African religion. Apparently, you seem to believe that all slaves were uneducated, uncivilized and without contact with major religious faiths.

            Do a bit of research and educate yourself further. I suggest you begin with individuals such as: Crispus Attucs, Yarrow Mamout, Estevanico, Norsereddin, “Hi Jolly”, Abdulrahman Ibrahim Ibn Sori, Ayuba Suleiman Diallo, Omar Ibn Said, Bampett Muhammad, Yusuf Ben Ali, Peter Buckminster…

          • Bimu

            Your fellowship is confrontational.

          • AKLady

            Fellowship?
            Confrontational?
            Providing factual information is neither fellowship or confrontation.

          • tasharina1

            It’s estimated that the Muslim slaves were about 15%, which is a definite minority. Perhaps I should have said that very few of the slaves were Muslim compared to non Muslim Blacks and Irish. But, thank you for directing me to interesting materials, I was not aware of, that I can read.

          • AKLady

            The Irish were servants North of the Mason Dixon line. The Irish came to America in mass as a result of thw potato famine.
            .
            You confuse the status of employee with slave.
            One works for pay and is free to change employment.
            An indentured servant usually has a signed contract document.
            They worked to pay the debt of their travel to America.
            When you take a car loan, or mortgage on a house, you become sn indentured servant …
            A slave is property. Most did not have the ability to earn money with which to buy their freedom.

          • Bimu

            Millions ? Really ? By whose calculations and by what standard do you calculate with that outcome ?

            Not to negate the fact hat it takes two to tango, slavery never was nor will be a one sided issue…somebody’s buying and somebody’s “selling” or receiving something for the humanity that is on the trading block. Please also remember you don’t have to be a slave to be worked like a beast of burden and still have nothing to show for it.

            There is no excuse or room for slavery in the earthly life but history is what it is and being hateful or non-forgiving is only going to perpetuate the harshness that was. Making false comparisons plays upon lack of knowledge and emotions. This is poor journalism and the editors shouldn’t let falsities go to print !

          • tasharina1

            Well said. But, she has a right to her opinion, since this is not a news site. That’s what I like about opinion sites. Sometimes I make mistakes and get corrected and I am grateful of that because I Iearn. It causes me to go look up what I thought I knew and learn more about it, so it’s all good to me. But, unfortunately a lot of people don’t come here to discuss and learn and just want to push their opinions, based on feelings instead of facts, which is easily disregarded by someone who knows the facts. Like you:)

          • Bimu

            Thank You. It is a welcomed relief to read someone who is fair minded. Someone willing to admit to err but then willing to learn. Quite refreshing ! You probably have made many friends over your life and they have been blessed by your qualities.

            I appreciate being grounded by your comment. Thank you for making to effort ! Be Well and Merry Christmas !!!

          • tasharina1

            You have a wonderful Christmas too and may you be blessed with love and abundant happiness.

          • Bimu

            I (we) will, I have been and I shall be !!! From the South….Merry Christmas and ain’t it great to find people who are nice, polite and conscientious.

          • Barry

            Agreed. As a confessing Lutheran, the same commendable attribute has, for the most part, been lost within the visible church in America. We desperately need the confessing church and it’s presence, else it become’s a casualty of the pietism movement which we don’t need any more of. Pride is the fountainhead of all sins. Thank you for your post, and Merry Christmas!

          • Bimu

            Hey, Barry ! I am a Southern Baptist, state of Georgia. Satan is constantly attacking but we have the ultimate defender and He who forgives us when we come up short. The day I think I know it all, that I am better than you, that I think I am THE gift to THIS world is the moment I know I let Satan take my soul because I refused the Light and Love of the Redeemer of THIS world. With folks like you and Tasharina1 then I have hope that despite my faults and shortcomings, there are folks on the “good” path who are willing to give me some discipline, some correction and some encouragement.

          • Barry

            Thank you. A true brother or sister in the faith who is willing to hold me and others accountable for my actions for my own good is a friend and blessing for which I give thanks to God for.

          • Bimu

            Blessings to You and Yours !!! My gratitude to the Lord for You ALL!!!

          • Pure BS…

          • A self discription?

          • We “need” to get rid of ALL religions! ALL religions foment religious terrorism! ALL religions are evil mental illness…

          • CHARLES S

            “ALL religions foment religious terrorism!”—Oh really? How many Jews, Muslims, Asians, etc has the Catholic /Christian religion murdered lately or committed religious terrorism in the name of Christianity? ( Do NOT give me any bible quotes or talk to me about what happened during the Crusade era)—I want numbers and dates of all the terrorists acts the Christian religion has committed………Please enlighten me…

          • AKLady

            Here is a short list. Start at the end of the list …
            The Crusades, The Inquisition, The witch hunts, The Peasants War, French Wars of rebellion, Massacre at Vassy, The Thirty Years War, Pope Sixtus V, Irish Rebellion, Democide in the Americas, Democide in Africa, Democide in Australia, The papal bull Romanus Pontifex – 1455, Slavery in the Americas, Leopold II, King of the Belgians – butcher of the Congo Free State 1885-1908, The Holocaust, Catholic Nazi State in Croatia, Lebanon War, Sabta and Shatila Massacre, Serb Orthodox genocide, Protestant death squads in Ireland, The Rwandan genocide, Zimbabwe — Catholic protection of Mugabe, Lord’s Resistance Army, Central African Republic Catholic murdering of those who won’t convert …, Americans killing physicians and bombing medical clinics, Americans killing church congregations; America – the KKK murders (they are now international terrorists).

          • AKLady

            Oh, and in addition to the list below, please note:

            America has more prisons than the rest of the entire modern world combined. Those prisons are filled with “Christians”. There are 30 gun-related murders and 162 people wounded by firearms in the US. each day.

          • CHARLES S

            The only one with a huge “mental illness” is YOU, so buzz off Buzz WEIRDO.

          • Barry

            Wanting to ‘get rid of all religions’ is a religion itself. Absurd. Impossible. Religion simply is one expressing ones’ beliefs. The only way religion disappears is if people disappear. Those who want to get rid of religion are those religions who oppose absolute Truth. I call them relativists. With a relativist, there is nothing true or false.

          • You sound retarded !!! How about LEARN some FACTS:
            ALL RELIGIONS = ADDICTION to being LIED TO, an ENFORCED PSYCHOSIS, and WRITTEN ORDERS for their customers to HATE, HURT, and MURDER EVERYONE on the planet! .. i.e. Armageddon, Left Behind movies, Story of Noah’s Ark, Holocaust, 9/11, Jim Jones, David Koresh, Oklahoma City Bombing, Sandy Hook School, Las Vegas mass murdering, Somalia Bombing, etc…

          • Barry

            Wanting to ‘get rid of all religions’ is a religion itself. Absurd. Impossible. Religion simply is one expressing ones’ beliefs. The only way religion disappears is if people disappear. Those who want to get rid of religion are those religions who oppose absolute Truth. I call them relativists. With a relativist, there is nothing true or false.

          • Bill Fortune

            they may have a ‘right” to their opinion, although no right to make statements of “fact” and then call others names !!!

          • AKLady

            When backed into a corner, insult …
            .
            By who’s calculation? Account books such as those held by my ancestors in Virginia, Georgia, Louisiana, Alabama, Texas …

            By who’s calculations? Account books kept by those who traded in slaves…
            .
            By historic records of Islam in Africa …

          • AKLady

            You obviously do not know what being worked as a beast of burden entails …

          • Barry

            Re: AKLady
            So says the devil’s propaganda mouthpiece, “da television” or government “schools”. Communism is promoted not with bombs or missiles, but with propaganda and lies. This “We brought Muslims here in chains..” is another example of such propaganda.

          • Bill Fortune

            What religion did the Blacks from Africa have;; I didn’t know it was Muslim.

          • AKLady

            Many were Muslim.
            Islam spread to Africa about 600 CE.

          • Bimu

            They have about as many religions as they do tribes. I could be wrong but I do not think religion was a unifying factor among Africans.

          • Many Africans are Muslim… large percentage… also Jewish…

          • ted towny

            Proof a-hole?

          • AKLady

            Sewer language us evidence of illiteracy.
            Name calling is nursery school behavior.
            You just provided all the “proof” needed.

          • Muslims are quiet when in a tiny minority… get vicious as numbers improve… ALL religions are evil like that…

          • AKLady

            You are terribly confused. Islam is the world’s second largest religion.

          • What’s that you say?

            What a liar. Typical baby killer spewing garbage.

        • Alibaba

          My God!… Forest Gump has a description of you. In full colors and 100% accurate; ” stupid is and stupid does”…

          • tasharina1

            What you just said is stupid. Everything he said is true and it doesn’t stop being true because you don’t believe it.

          • CHARLES S

            You must be describing yourself… thanks for the heads up.

          • Bill Fortune

            And what is he doing that is so “stupid” ???

        • What’s that you say?

          Bravo !!

      • AKLady

        So much bigotry. So many assumptions.
        Maybe you should remember that our Founders were not only liberals, but traitors to their nation, as well? Yes, Bill, our Founders were British subjects before they became Americans.

        • Bimu

          So then, everyone should just go back to their prehistorical cave and eat worms ?

      • Have you done anything about it? You use the word “yo”. Are you for the asylum seekers, or merely to lazy to have come up with an idea to help stop this incursion of islamics who won’t assimilate into this great country after we take their begging masses in, but rather have changed whole cities to make them into THEIR cities complete with the US willing to give them sharia law. This country percentage wise is mostly Christian and must stay this way.

        • Bill Fortune

          Maybe go back are read my comments to Charles S. We won’t be a “Christian Nation” for long. Others out birth us 2 to 1, and that was 2015. Now the younger generation is having even fewer babies.

          • I get where you’re coming from now and am in total agreement. The immigrant numbers must drop dramatically, and if not for rinos we’d have a good portion of the wall built plus many other items the President was voted in for.

    • AKLady

      All Muslims are not terrorists. All terrorists are not Muslim.

      Christians do more than there share. America’s prisons are full of Christians.

      Chtistian history of killing is long and huge: The Crusades, The Inquisition, The witch hunts, The Peasants War, French Wars of rebellion, Massacre at Vassy, The Thirty Years War, Pope Sixtus V, Irish Rebellion, Democide in the Americas, Democide in Africa, Democide in Australia, The papal bull Romanus Pontifex – 1455, Slavery in the Americas, Leopold II, King of the Belgians – butcher of the Congo Free State 1885-1908, The Holocaust, Catholic Nazi State in Croatia, Lebanon War, Sabta and Shatila Massacre, Serb Orthodox genocide, Protestant death squads in Ireland, The Rwandan genocide, Zimbabwe — Catholic protection of Mugabe, Lord’s Resistance Army, Central African Republic Catholic murdering of those who won’t convert …, Americans killing physicians and bombing medical clinics, Americans killing church congregations; America – the KKK murders (they are now international terrorists).

      • Alibaba

        You forgot Napoleon, Hitler, and few others, but what’s your point anyway?
        Yes, Christianity did terrible things in name of God, but never in its holly scripts encourage to commit murder like the [email protected] coran does! And so far 1.4 billion people believe that kind of crap, and try to be holly by it’s standards!

        • Bimu

          Amen Sister !!!

        • Kathryn Jordan

          Quran does not encourage murder. What makes Islam violent is when someone takes it to the extreme to the point of terrorism. Not all Muslims are terrorists; some are because they have radicalized Islam to violence. The rest are trying to live in peace.

        • AKLady

          Leviticus 20:13 “If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them.” So, does the Bible require us today to put homosexuals to death?…

          The Bible condemns ALL sexual activity that is not between a husband and wife, whether it is homosexual or heterosexual conduct. (1 Corinthians 6:18)

        • AKLady

          Oh, and dig out your English book and refresh your memory as to what is meant by “….”

      • Bimu

        Shall we list the Muslim/Islam atrocities – to this day – and how they just admire all their women and non-heterosexual folks and so on and so forth.

        • AKLady

          Shall we list ALL the Christian atrocities – to this day – and how they just admire all their women and non-heterosexual folks and so on and so forth.
          ..
          You are a prime example of brainwashing.

          For example, there are more women judges in Muslim countries than there are in all of America …

          The stereotype of a woman hidden behind a veil, a voiceless, silent figure, bereft of rights does not exist in reality. Islam exists in many lands with many diverse cultures. And nations are, by existing as nations, distinct and different from one another. No two cultures are alike.

    • Very true.

    • Well said; and I agree Roy.

    • Kathryn Jordan

      that’s true. it’s like reliving “the slaughter of the innocence” that Herod did at the time of Jesus’ birth with these people. They sure did not take a page out of the wise men who came in peace.

    • Ted Trafka

      The most needy are the Christians and other minorities. I read that Turkey has no Christians left worth counting in a census. Middle East people are mostly o.k. but taking out the fear response on the very people that are most victimized is not smart.

  • sheriff12

    Every person on the left have lost their collective minds!

    • dennis w

      been that way for a loooooooong time………

      • AKLady

        Our Founders were liberals …

        • Bimu

          So liberals are slave drivers then ! Government dependence or Government independence – which is it ?

          • AKLady

            What un the world are you referring to?

    • Herb1949

      Not sure they ever had one. If they did they would not be on the left.

      • AKLady

        Then how do you explain Washington, Jefferson, Adams ….
        Not only were they liberals, but they were also traitors.

        • Bimu

          Two sides to every coin ? Do you flip over easily or just flip out easily ?

          • Kathryn Jordan

            You have such a “CLOSED” mind and are not willing to accept the fact that Washington, Jefferson, Adams and the rest of our Founding Fathers were liberals (for their time) but they were also traitors. They were breaking away from England which was viewed as treasonous to King George III.

          • Bimu

            Yes and children and teens tend to be “liberal” and then they grow up and deal with the facts of life and often times grow into conservatives.

            The Monarch thought everyone was treasonous unless they bowed down to him and freely and wantonly filled his coffers. So yes, they were traitors. I suppose all immigrants are traitors by that definition. Fortunately you don’t have to write government documents from the get go, put your entire life and that of your family in everyday danger with your heritage at risk. So anyway, technically yes, traitors they were. To history, they were brave, wise, hearty men who set a course that has changed the world as did the birth of Christ.

          • Kathryn Jordan

            You are right that our Founding Fathers were brave, wise and honest men who had the courage to change their course of who would rule over them; themselves or King George III. They chose to rule themselves and split away from England. I look at things from both sides and then come to a decision and pray I have made the correct decision. I am glad that these men had the guts to change the course of history by breaking from England when they did. Just like I am glad the world was changed with the birth of Christ, his teachings, death and finally resurrection.

          • Bimu

            AMEN and AMEN !!! We have been eternally blessed ! To You and Yours, innumerable blessings !!!

          • Kathryn Jordan

            The same to you as well. Blessings for a Blessed Christmas season and a Happy New Year to you and yours

    • old27

      That would be “Mind,” singular, as the concept of the “progressives/democrats/or whatever is in on any day” having more than one mind is inane and farcical, just ask them. They have one repetitive drivel/mind/idea/program (take your choice) that goes on forever ad nauseam.

      • truthwanted

        Speaking of ad nauseum drivel, how about their silly kindergarten mentality slanders, like “islamophobia”, and calling others what they are, such as “racist” and “haters”. To follow their bullshi* does indeed require they have NO MIND. I call them regressives, instead of progressives.

        • READY2SCRAP

          Intellectually retarded, retarded in an intellectual way to progress backwards…

          • AKLady

            Repetitiveness is simply poor writing ability.
            “Retarded” is no longer acceptable in proper discourse. It is simply rude and indicates a lack of academic progress on the part of thw writer.

          • Bimu

            Your academic progress shows little in regard to the actual human condition mired in sin, illness, death and all sorts of frailty and fault. A spade is a spade but there varying shades of chocolate.

          • AKLady

            You have failed to master English …
            Human decency seems also to be out of your reach.

        • AKLady

          Sewer language is evidence of illiteracy.
          Name calling is nursery school behavior.

          • Alibaba

            And you know that because what?… You heard about at Berkeley or NYSU?…

          • AKLady

            Go to Amazon, search for “Best Sellers in Etiquette Guides”. Teach yourself all those things your parents forgot to teach you …

          • Bimu

            Surely you understand you can be cursed out and never have heard the/any “standard” curse word(s) ?

      • AKLady

        Yes, that defines the “right” very well, thank you.

    • AKLady

      The majority on the right seems to express hate bigotry and lies.
      It seems to be a collective form of mental illness.

      • Bimu

        Is this your educated, intellectual yet lack of academic progress and evidence of illiteracy ?

        • AKLady

          Is that supposed to be an insujlt?

  • fbair1

    Seriously, the NYT is a sick rag not even worthy of a response. These aren’t refugees, they are 95% fighting age young men. Luckily 1 old time American in battle is worth 10 of those punks.

  • Kenny Albert

    Why aren’t these refugees returning home to THEIR OWN country as did Mary and Joseph? The left wouldn’t know the Christmas story or want to anyway. It is against everything they believe.

    • Jackalyn Morrison

      You are SOOO RIGHT

    • CHARLES S

      Because their sole purpose is to indoctrinate our children and for the devote Muslims their main focus is to force us to accept Islam or pay the ultimate price. Their Sharia law is not compatible to the U S Constitution and therefore they plan to abolish our constitution and we will be forced to accept their Sharia law. Plus the fact that they would be stupid to go back to their respective countries when we have so much more to offer (like our social services, food stamps, medicaid, etc). HERE ARE SOME FACTS MANY U S CITIZENS ARE NOT AWARE OF :BENEFITS TO REFUGEES
      Many Immigration Benefits Are Available to Refugees
      NOVEMBER 5, 2015 BY FAIR STAFF
      To qualify as a refugee, a person must meet the following definition from Section 101(a)(42) of the Immigration and Nationality Act (INA):
      “any person who… is unable or unwilling to return to, and is unable or unwilling to avail himself or herself of the protection of that country because of persecution or a well-founded fear of persecution on account of race, religion, nationality, membership in a particular social group, or political opinion….”
      Here are four things to remember about immigration benefits available to refugees:
      * Refugees (as distinguished from asylum grantees) receive a broad range of benefits and services (e.g. complete Furnishing for FREE or Subsidized Housing) that are NOT available to U.S. citizens who are homeless and indigent.There are still significant numbers of aliens resettled as refugees who are in fact admitted under the Lautenberg Amendment and thus do not have to meet the evidentiary standards for establishing status under INA 207. The related Specter Amendment includes Iranian nationals in this special category. Congress has reauthorized the loopholes annually in the 1970s.
      * Only refugees who are designated as eligible for a presidentially designated “priority program” are offered resettlement. The third priority for refugee selection (P-3) is referred to by the Department of State as the “Anchor Family Program” because it is almost entirely derivatives of previously settled refugees, justified on the basis of “family unity” rather than protection from persecution. For example, adult children of previously settled refugees are in this priority category due to the CSPA legislation.
      * Entrants on certain Special Immigrant Visas also receive a high level of public benefits similar to that granted to refugees.
      NOT BAD FOR BENEFITS, IS IT??!! MIND YOU, THESE BENEFITS ARE “NOT” AVAILABLE TO US CITIZENS OR OUR INDIGENT!! How fair does that sound to you???

      • libsrtheh8ters

        They also get a “resettlement” stipend, a cash lump sum, compliments of the American taxpayers.

  • J.B. Young

    Refugees my foot! No widows and children came, but young men who should have been fighting for their own country.

    There are countries in the Middle East who could have taken in any refugees. But the only true refugees were the Christians who were being murdered. Note that obama did not bring in these people, just the muslims.

  • parthenon1

    Just what could a bunch of atheists like the NY Times (BIRD CAGE BOTTOM COVER) know about the birth of Christ ? They believe Barack Obama was the saviour when he is the Anti Christ !

  • CCblogging

    Deep State Globalist Stooge Barack Obama promised to create a massive civilian army in his first term. One as big and as powerful as our US Military. Obama imported a massive amount of male Muslims of Jihad age and many more came through Obama’s open borders agenda. Obama shipped those Jihad age Muslims all over the USA. Obama’s Muslims along with other Soros groups will eventually attack us in massive numbers. Be ready, get yourself a gun, buy lots of ammo, learn gun safety and practice often.

    • Maxine Albritton

      a machine gun at best. or whatever they call the repeat fire weapons. a six bullet chamber would be like a pea shooter or sling shot.

    • B737-300

      Myself and all my friend and neighbors have been getting ready for years. When our government lets us down, we have to be ready to protect ourselves from outsiders as well as tyrants in our government.

      • Alibaba

        When was the last time government actually helped you?…

      • CCblogging

        Good

  • luv1nl1fe

    Oh my GOSH! Bethlehem had “refugees” thrown into their cities by corrupt elected officials, too??? I just did not know this!! I’ll bet the “refugees” that were thrown into Bethlehem were not vetted just like the ones thrown into OUR cities were not vetted!! I wonder if Bethlehem’s crime rate went up like it did in Europe and Australia? You know, I have not really read anything the Times has written since the election because of its mindless dribble. This article is exactly why I have not read anything. Well wishers are not “refugees”. The Prophets were not “refugees” nor were the 3 wise men. I believe I could believe more facts from the Globe, the Star or the National Enquirer rather than trying to put any kind of belief into a “story”, and I say that loosely, like this. Besides, this is my opinion and opinions are like behinds, everyone has one! Merry Christmas, one and all!

  • CCblogging

    This Is What The Democrats Have Planned For America With Their Imported Muslim Invasion!

    THE BRITISH HAVE SURRENDERED TO THE MUSLIM INVASION

    Mayor of London … MUSLIM
    Mayor of Birmingham … MUSLIM
    Mayor of Leeds … MUSLIM
    Mayor of Blackburn … MUSLIM
    Mayor of Sheffield … MUSLIM
    Mayor of Oxford … MUSLIM
    Mayor of Luton … MUSLIM
    Mayor of Oldham … MUSLIM
    Mayor of Rochdale … MUSLIM
    Over 3,000 Muslim Mosques
    Over 130 Muslim Sharia Courts
    Over 50 Muslim Sharia Councils
    Muslims-Only No-Go Areas Across The UK
    Muslim Women … 78% don’t work and are on FREE benefits/housing
    Muslim Men … 63% don’t work and are on FREE benefits/housing
    Muslim Families … 6-8 children planning to go on FREE benefits/housing
    … and now all UK schools are ONLY serving HALAL MEAT!

    All this achieved by just 4 million Muslims out of the 66 million population!

    • imabrummie

      You appear to be saying the majority of these people are nothing but a bunch of freeloading parasites who should be hustled onto some type of craft and shipped back to their own countries. Would my understanding of your synopsis be correct?

      • kimbi

        That would be mine.
        And if that craft didn’t quite “make it” few would mourn.

      • Bernie

        Ima,
        Correct! Do you see anything wrong with that? If so, tell me why.
        Next question….?!

        • imabrummie

          No, I see absolutely NOTHING wrong with your thoughts on this question. I truly resent very deeply the fact that my hard-earned tax dollars are put towards supporting these unworthy individuals who seem to imagine they are entitled to be kept by others with no contributions of any kind made by themselves. What a pity western governments cannot see the wisdom in shipping these folk back from whence they came but would rather spend other people’s money to bring these folk here and give them benefits they have not earned.

      • CCblogging

        You seem a little slow with your perception but the answer is yes!

    • 615GEJ1

      Winston Churchill would weep to see what is becoming of the nation he fought so hard to save from the Nazis. Islam has all but conquered the nation once known as Great Britain!

    • rickmart

      WOW,NOT HERE!!

  • CCblogging

    In the past 1400 years of Islam, Muslims have killed 120 million Africans, 90 million Hindus, 80 million Christians, 10 million Buddhists, and millions of their own. Over 100 verses in the Quran call for the rape, torture, and pillaging of infidels, or non-Muslims. Islam is Satanic.

    • Maxine Albritton

      in truth you are so correct.

    • Alibaba

      So much truth in so few words!

  • Mike

    The U.S needs to be kicking Muslims OUT, not bring them in. Let other Muslim Countries take them in.

  • Joseph Abraham

    No comparison here, the majority of these individuals are young men, fighting men? Not real refugees. I think the president has the right idea. Stop them from coming here until they can be properly vetted.

    • Marvin2514

      It’s stealth jihad. Send your fighters in disguised as “refugees”. It’s Trojan Horse.

      • Joseph Abraham

        No arguments from me.

      • CHARLES S

        Hijrah: conquest through immigration.

        • Marvin2514

          Exactly and it’s koran approved.

    • imabrummie

      You describe them as “men”. My thoughts on that are they may have the appropriate plumbing but that does not automatically make them men. If they were truly men they would stay and fight to make their own countries better places and there would be fewer individuals fleeing to western countries for hard-pressed taxpayers to maintain.

      • EdWatts

        There is no reason to fight for anything in their home countries, as far as they’re concerned; they like things just like they are, so, they are not “escaping” anything. They are coming to Europe and the Americas to wage jihad against the infidels.

        • Maxine Albritton

          right on perfect post.

      • Maxine Albritton

        their motive for not doing that is the same as it has been for centuries but in the past at the time of Jefferson they were kept back. the idiots of today love them and let them move forward into our countries,. Once they move in they don’t go back worse than cockroaches or ticks to get rid of.

      • CHARLES S

        Most of those men have fled and the women have taken up arms like the Yazidi women: The Yazidis are a majority-Kurdish-speaking religious group living mostly in northern Iraq. They number less than one million worldwide. The Yazidis, throughout their history, have been persecuted as infidels by Muslim rulers who demanded that they convert. Yazidis have suffered massacres and oppression for generations.

        Astonishing cruelty by ISIS on a group of women in northern Iraq has inspired them to take up arms and fight the terror group. A battalion made up of persecuted Yazidi women who survived being raped and tortured are taking on Islamic State fighters who have destroyed their way of life. They have picked up weapons and undergone military training and swapped traditional dress for combat fatigues. Now these are women with the balls that their men don’t have! They did not flee but stayed to fight ISIS while the men left them behind—not all men deserted these women.

  • Clete Tacker

    Just another socialist/ communist liberal attempt to put a guilt trip on us believers. They are “refugees” because of their “religion”, the muslim cult. Now they spread out around western civilization and attempt to destroy us from within. Send them all HOME.

  • Bill Giles

    There is at least one very distinct difference. There were three wiseman in the Christmas story.

    • John Degges

      Actually the wise men were not in the Christmas story itself. They came sometime afterwards, when the family was in a house and not a stable. Also, when the family went tot the temple to present their offering after the birth of Jesus, their offering was that of poor people, not of a portion of any of the gifts the wise men gave them.

  • Darleen Smith

    Consider the source and see that the source has no belief in the God of creation or anything to do with Christ or the Jews that followed Jesus to be the passers on of Christianity. They are working for the devil believe it or not.

  • David W Dyer

    There is a lot of difference between now and 2000 years ago as far as migration goes. I have no problem with legal migration just illegal migration.

  • Sue Madaus

    This bunch of “refugees” would have helped crucify Jesus after cutting off his head and throwing him off a building and then raped his mother and father.. So no manger in my sheep cote for them

  • Herb1949

    Does anyone really expect the left to get the facts correct?

  • David Stewart

    The Commies at NYT can’t even tell the difference between migration and invasion. Poor brain-dead idiots!

  • old27

    Read volume 2 of Mark Twain’s “Innocents Abroad” for a clear picture of the world from Syria to Jerusalem and trips through the Holy Land. An idiot from the nyt”s idea of the journeys of Jesus is like Lenin describing the same from the Kremlin. Neither is based in any form of reality. Just read the book; it is educational, enjoyable and reports what Twain saw, not made up babble.

  • Sidney S

    Trump’s a racist bcuz he wants to protect Americans from criminal illegal aliens? Comparing Joseph, Mary & Jesus to foreign hooligans? Years ago the New York Times was a world leader. I was campaigning for our Democratic govenor in my state. Now bcuz of their constant bias for the Left. Why bother you know how they are going to twist the story. So much distortion of the facts.

  • merrychicago

    Actually, Jesus’ parents were following the law and traveling to take part in the census. Legally they were where they were supposed to be.

    • John Degges

      Exactly.

  • I say to the New York Times, horse pucky. There is no comparison to a refugee camp. A stable was not a place to give birth to a child. It was smelly and unsanitary. So was the horse trough Jesus was placed in. The parents wrapped him in mere cloth which likely was not too sanitary either. I am not aware of any labor camp that forced women to utilize a horse stable for a birth place. The only inn was full. Since Mary was in labor, they had no other choice. Yes, Jerusalem was some five miles away but the “road” was two ruts in the sand andvtrheir mode of transportation was a donkey, not a Corvette.

    • John Degges

      I doubt that any horses were stabled therein; donkeys, perhaps. By the way, a manger is used to hold food, not water.

      • John,

        I am sure it was donkeys. Yes, a stable holds hay or some sort of food. As the donkey said to the manger, Is my
        fodder in there? Yes, a manger holds feed. I don’t remember mentioning water.

  • Mark Leonard

    Christ’s parents were NOT refugees. They were from the country they were in. They were required to register because the Occupying ruler’s, namely the Romans, were keeping track of the People they had conquered. So the NYT and the Democrat’s, are as usual, grasping at straws to in anyway that they can think of to disparage President Trump and the Republican Party. When will they give up trying to tear our Country apart.

    • Sol_of_Texas

      The Quirinius Census of 6 AD was not so much for “keeping track” of the newly occupied province as to obtain a head count for the purpose of provincial taxation and tribute. Today, the IRS doesn’t rely on the Census Bureau but uses computer databases to enforce the (immoral) 16th Amendment and tax code – 😮

  • kimbi

    Another load of garbage from the NYT’s. To even try to compare Jesus to the absolute filth invading our Countries is sickening.
    Many of these young “men” of fighting age sit in your 11 year old daughters classroom claiming to be 14 years old. You can guess nothing good is going to come from that.
    So anyways, to compare Jesus with camel urine drinking, goat boffing, street pooping, nasty heathens is pure NYT garbage.
    Bet she wouldn’t put up with one in her home.

  • JFSEB

    The National Enquirer should acquire the NYT—their reputation would give the public much more confidence in the Time’s veracity.

  • E. Bolen

    You would think that at least one editor at the NY Times would have at some time in their life have read the Bible. Or maybe the fact is they no long have “real” editors who check a story before putting it in print. There is absolutely no comparison between people traveling to a place to register, and a group you have moved here to ASSIMULATE the people of the USA into their own culture.

    • John Degges

      Why should anyone at the New York Times take time to read the Bible so as to understand what it tells us? They seem to have no use for the facts found therein.

    • Gene Hollon

      Joseph was a carpenter. He worked . He worked and did NOT draw a government check. Mary and Joseph went there to PAY TAXES.
      HUUUGGH difference in the millions of our invaders , here ONLY to leach off the American tax payers.

  • just care

    Their attempts at brainwashing are only effective when you have a leader like Obama encouraging it. When you have a real person like Trump, they’re ignored even by many liberals.
    I predict there will be a lot less liberals after Trump’s term/s .

  • 2399molly

    I bet none of them have read the story of why Joseph and Mary went to Bethlehem. Too bad.

  • Sol_of_Texas

    The comparison by Ms. Saldana is not a stretch – it is a ridiculous stretch.

  • Once again a leftist self-proclaimed educated reporter/writer attempts with 1/2 truths, not giving the whole story. My being in her realm a conservative dunce immediately in her story noted that Joseph & Mary had not abandoned their country out of persecution but were simply returning to their original home to be taxed (a term used then for census taking). She must consider her readership to be uneducated retards when the actual shoe of retardation is worn by her.

  • Yosemite Sam

    And the media wonders why those of us who never drank the Leftist koolaid refer to the propaganda outlets as “Fake News”. What a crock . . .

  • John Degges

    It is evident that the writer of this screed has absorbed little of the account of the birth of our Savior. As other responders have pointed out, there is absolutely no
    comparison between the the Nativity account and the account of the hordes of people who have recently come into our nation from the Middle East.

  • bill14729 .

    obama was Satan Himself

  • Big difference. Jesus came to seek and save every person from the bondage of sin and to set them free for an eternal life with God, the creator of this universe.
    . Many of the refugees come for what they can receive and bring along the luggage of a Satanic faith and religion to destroy everything our God has provided for.
    . When you understand the difference, then you will also want every person entering our Constitutional Republic, … formed with Godly wisdom with a heritage of patriotic people who would die to defend it and its flag and proudly sing its hymns our pledge respect, …. that we want every person who enters to have the same dream of those ideals and values and wish to contribute to make this country greater and more free than before.
    Merry Christmas and keep praying.

  • Stephen Pettine

    Saldaña unwittingly made not a comparison but disparate set of circumstances in trying to put a spin on refugees by using the plight of Mary and Joseph and the Nativity. But, Democrats as a rule are inept at trying to pull off similar absurdities.engendered by their festering hate, disappointment, along with a strong dose of irrationality. It would be interesting if she similarly associated Santa, his elves, his reindeer and sleigh with some other historical event to advance whatever leftist cause that exists in the political arena.

  • Scott Rose

    NYC is like the most pagan place on the planet, why should we listen to anything it says about Jesus.

  • Jerry Hughes

    I wonder if the NYT and the Washington Post remember the name of Timothy McVeigh?
    After reading some of the nonsense published by those rag a muffins, you have to suspect that they will make the intimate acquaintance of large quantities of high explosives.

  • Teresa Barrett

    The strong young Muslim men in refugee camps are nothing more than an invading army. They are there to be ready to attack the country that has welcomed them with open arms. Muslims are sneaky, lying, savages who will do anything to push their barbaric beliefs on to who ever they encounter. We should allow NO MUSLIM REFUGEES into the U.S., regardless of origin country. They are nothing but trouble!

  • Randall clark

    DONT EVEN BEGIN TO COMPARE REFUGEES WITH THE BABY JESUS!!! THERE IS NO COMPARISON, AND DOESNT EVEN COME CLOSE!!!

  • Maxine Albritton

    no comparison it also sounds like these are refugee males no women, no children. sounds like a militia on the move rather than a family affair. these are not people of peace either.

  • 615GEJ1

    There is no validity to the NYT’s narrative here.

  • Jmanjo

    The NYT doesn’t know what they are doing anymore! Misled media just keeps posting poor news and faking their way to the finish line! What liberal whacks!

  • Susan Wood

    Our female priest deacon gave a similar sermon today – except she used the Flight to Egypt as the comparison to today’s refugees’ plight. Yes, she’s a Leftie, and I couldn’t really follow her point.

  • Lets be clear Joseph and Mary were not refugees fleeing their Country. They were going to Bethlehem to pay their taxes and when they got there the inn was full. So they had to take a room in a stable. Do not compare Jesus Christ to any of these refugees. There is no comparison. Everyone Have Merry Christmas and read the story of the Birth of Jesus in Luke chapter 2

  • CHARLES S

    Go pitch your story some where else—–What she should be focused on is the genocide of the Middle East Christians by ISIS and the demonic mentally insane ‘devote’ Muslims. Where is her compassion for those Christians, for the thousands of women and children being murdered?! Why is it that its mostly MEN of strength and wearing Western jeans and cell phones that are coming into our country and all of Western and Eastern Europe ( but going to those countries for the sole purpose of getting the most social services and benefits)….Despicable and cowardly!

    • disqus_mo8ewPYVck

      YOU said it best!! TWO thumbs-up for you!!

  • disqus_mo8ewPYVck

    This article is pure baloney, written by a leftist drone who has no idea what she is pandering to.

    “…The land is as the garden of Eden before them, and behind them a desolate wilderness.” Joel 2:3

    ANYWHERE Islam is prevalent or has conquered, take a look at where they live. There is no industry, there are no farms, no orchards, or cattle ranches. They consume the resources of everywhere they go, and consume they do, but give nothing back.

    Now would be a good time to start seriously considering what the Bible says about the last days.

  • truthwanted

    Good exposure of deceiver traitor, new york slimes. Trump is doing an excellent thing in exposing the lamestream spews media, which have needed to be exposed for deceitful treason, FOR DECADES. Nice too, would be their FULL PROSECUTION FOR BEING TRAITORS!

  • CHARLES S

    The number of Christians among the 10,000 will be less than Half of One Percent.
    Even worse 9,945 of the Syrian refugees are Sunni Muslims.

    If the U.S. had trouble vetting refugees from Iraq, where it had occupied the country and had access to all law enforcement and intelligence records, how can it vet people claiming to be fleeing Syria?
    FBI Director James Comey admitted last year before Congress that vetting Syrians is impossible. The president and his State Department have focused instead on the humanitarian aspect of helping widows and orphans.
    But concerns include more than just terrorism. There’s also the issue of cost. Refugees, unlike most other immigrants, qualify for a full slate of welfare benefits on day one of their arrival. Those age 65 and over immediately receive Social Security benefits and 91 Percent of refugees from the Middle East receive Food Stamps, according to the U.S. Office of Refugee Resettlement.
    Congress approved Obama’s $1.1 TRILLION omnibus spending package in December, and it fully funded the president’s expanded refugee program, which will spend about $1.2 billion to resettle 85,000 foreign refugees from all countries in fiscal 2016. Another 100,000 are slated for arrival in 2017. That figure — $1.2 BILLION — does not include the cost of welfare benefits nor does it include the cost of educating refugee children.

  • CHARLES S

    Here are four things to remember about Immigration benefits available to Refugees:
    *
    Refugees (as distinguished from asylum grantees) receive a broad range of benefits and services (e.g. complete Furnishing for FREE or Subsidized Housing) that are NOT available to U.S. citizens who are homeless and indigent.There are still significant numbers of aliens resettled as refugees who are in fact admitted under the Lautenberg Amendment and thus do not have to meet the evidentiary standards for establishing status under INA 207. The related Specter Amendment
    includes Iranian nationals in this special category. Congress has reauthorized the loopholes annually in the 1970s.
    * Only refugees who are designated as eligible for a presidentially designated “priority program” are offered resettlement. The third priority for refugee selection (P-3) is referred to by the Department of State as the “Anchor Family Program” because it is almost entirely derivatives of previously settled refugees, justified on the basis of “family unity” rather than protection from persecution. For example, adult children of previously settled refugees are in this priority category due to the CSPA legislation.
    * Entrants on certain Special Immigrant Visas also receive a high level of public benefits similar to that granted to refugees.
    NOT BAD FOR BENEFITS, IS IT??!! MIND YOU, THESE BENEFITS ARE “NOT” AVAILABLE TO U S CITIZENS OR OUR INDIGENT!! How fair does that sound to you???

  • libsrtheh8ters

    The difference being Joseph & Mary were not refugees, they were obeying the useless government to be counted in a census. They also did not arrive in Bethlehem & demand SPECIAL rights & welfare benefits. Oh, & they were not raised on anti-Semitic, anti-Christian, anti-everything but islam hatred & plot to murder everyone around them.

    MERRY CHRISTMAS!!

  • Tom Turner

    Saldana fail to comprehend Fleeing from Tyrannical Herod and the Invasion of Migrant Mob whose ambition is to subjugate the host Nations without assimilation..First Playing the Victim Card and when They have Multiplied Breeding and overtake the Native Population impose Sharia Law by Majority Rule .Lebenon is a glaring Example.

  • Steven

    80% of the illegal migration to Europe is economic, the rest is fleeing from the broken states (Syria, AF, Iraq, Yemen). Send back the economic migrants, and stop the wars in the rest of the countries and let things settle themselves. Otherwise a few million will become hundreds of millions. Does anyone want those in their backyard? The liberals in the press and elsewhere should move to the refugee camps and help out if they are so concerned.

    • AKLady

      The majority of illegals in the U.S. entered on employment visas.
      U.S. employers lied to obtain those visas — stating no Americans were available to fill the jobs.

  • LeaM

    Jesus’s family weren’t refugees. Joseph, the head of the family was “of the house and lineage of (King) David” (as the Gospel according to St. Luke puts it) and they were traveling from their current home in Nazareth to Bethlehem, the City of David (a distance of maybe 10 miles, but that was a long way on a donkey). They were doing so — anti-tax-hikers, take note! — because the government of the day (based in Rome) had decreed “THAT ALL THE WORLD SHOULD BE TAXED.” Even assuming that means “all the Roman world” (since the Roman authorities wouldn’t have been able to tax, say, residents of the Persian Empire) it STILL suggests a massive tax grab by Caesar Augustus, the self-designated Roman Emperor. That’s what HAPPENS, folks, when the government gets (or takes) the right to tax anyone and everyone however it wants. 🙁

  • Alibaba

    Way before Christ birth, Bible tells us another story: that of Abel and Cain. One plowed the land and harvested food. The other one just came to murder and take what he pleased. Thousands years before that became reality! Now we are living it literary. Muslim famine is real. They don’t want to plow the land and harvest food, they just want to take it! And a woman or two in the mean time, after all, women are only accessories!…
    I think it is necessary to start exterminating this so called religion founded by a child rapist just to legalize his cravings and crimes! And by the way, Bible wasn’t written by Abel, nor Cain!…

  • donl

    Correction; They do not come in peace, they are here to Conquer!!! Open your eye’s America!!

  • America1st

    The NYT is without the truth about anything except when they occasionally happen to include the correct date somewhere in their failing rag so why is anyone surprised when they totally misrepresent the Christmas Story to Make yet another untrue political attack that no one believes.

  • CCblogging

    Merry Christmas Patriots!

  • Barry

    NY Times => LOST FOOLS! They wouldn’t know about Jesus or the celebration of His birth (Christmas) if it hit them in the head. 2 Cor 2:14 says: “Do not become unevenly yoked with unbelievers, for what participation is there between righteousness and lawlessness? Or what fellowship does light have with darkness? TLB. Don’t be teamed with those who do not love the Lord, for what do the people of God have in common with the people of sin? …”

    The NY Times is DARKNESS trying to describe Jesus (THE LIGHT). Duh!!

  • Estell Newton

    It figures that the article was written by someone from the Middle East.

  • regulus30

    I can not even get my head where liberals have theirs; up their assce.

  • Gregg Parker

    I find it more like his crucifixion…

  • I listen to nothing the LEFTY loons say.
    Completely off their rocker about so many things.
    There are things in life that just aren’t normal and the left’s refusal to acknowledge that is disturbing.
    Example…we had a Muslim president after 9/11 which in itself is unbelievably anti American and he created division like no other.
    Imagine a gay president, everything would be slanted towards that way of thinking, so anti American.
    Gays, Muslims or any other race or religion which goes against fundamental American ways is UNAMERICAN and UNACCEPTABLE.
    MAGA….I LOVE PRESIDENT TRUMP.

  • Randall Anderson

    Once again, the ignorance and stupidity and AGENDA of the LEFT is here for all to see. Collaborators with the Cult of Islam, too blind to see they would be the first to get theirs heads removed…for their idololatry, atheisim, LGBT etc and for all the JINOS in their midst. Allahu Akbar, stupid KUFFIRS…

  • tCotUS

    NYT/CNN/MSNBC is composed of Atheists/Socialists/Liberals, that need to go away…Permanently

  • DumAss Party also tries to compare genetic race to homosexuality addiction mental illness… NOT the same thing at all !!!

  • What’s that you say?

    Where would Jesus spend Christmas?
    Duh, easy question
    Jerusalem the capital of Israel of course.

  • Boommach

    There is a no more obscene way to use the Lord’s name in vain that to use Him for self agrandizement, profit, or the furtherance of one’s political agenda.

  • Jerry Skinner

    The world of Mary and Joseph had no NY Times to ramp up blood pressures with articles written by useless twits about a time that was the dark ages at least a millennia before the dark ages. You writers of fantasy, go find and arid mountainous desert filled with a conqueror so brutal that they butchered people in spectacles not with wit as on Meet the Press, your refuges would not last five minutes. You are idiots writing meaningless trash while your romanticized refugees create chaos in Europe, kill young women in SF and plot jihad everywhere. Why don’t you go and write a fictionalized account of how the animal carrying Mary to Bethlehem was a Democrat. Smelled like one, brayed likes one and had no common sense.

  • therealworld

    Liberals, and Muslims have ONE THING in Common, both groups HATE…..

  • Sylvia Avila

    NYT prove everyday they are just Anti-Americans! close that very corrupt organization!

  • Gavriil Tarlescu

    Another FAKE NEWS a-la liberals ! Don’t be surprised by this “brain inception” !

  • 4Pip

    These people are not truly refugees. This is planned population movement,they want to take away all national identities everywhere. They being the NWO,their plan is to ruin all places so the people won’t have anything. The so-called elites want to rule with everyone being subjected to them. Full Communism is the goal.

  • ADRoberts

    The ignorance of those who make remarks about Christianity when they have NOT A CLUE as to what we are about.
    THIS is a group of people who truly are trying to force THEIR ideas on others.

  • Louie Rey

    Yeah, sure. Because all of these refugees are going to save the world. If they were omnipotent don’t you think they’d save their OWN world? Who the f**k is kidding who here? Obviously not the Times.

  • OldSilk

    The wise men came to Bethlehem, worshipped the Christ Child and then went home. Jesus’ family took him into Egypt, and then they too went back home. In neither case did they get in anybody’s face and tell them they were there to stay. In neither case did they stay. They were sojourners. They came and they left.

  • CJ

    O, give me a break! Comparing refugees to Christ’s family? Really? Is that the BEST you can do?

  • doc suske

    Apparently even the Pope doesn’t realize Jesus parents were TRAVELLERS, not immigrants in their own country. Liberals seem to always try to rewrite history.

  • Tony B

    NYT = anti-Christ along with all those that reject the messiah. Their day will come and it will not be pretty for them. So sad! Praise to God in the highest.

  • Angel Dew

    AKLady I will iput my knowledge of politics up against yours any day, and Im just a dumb skaw that grew up with dirt floors and a outhouse.

  • Obie Miller

    These idiots must not know how to read their bible (if they even have one)!

  • bill thompson

    Jihadists for whom the crusades are just beginning. Murder in their hearts , rape n their minds..and you would be hard pressed to find 3 wise men and a virgin amongst them. we will be remembered as the generation of suicidal fools. And they would be wise to desecrate our statues. God bless Donald trump. He may have bought us 30 more years in liberty.

  • Getting rid of welfare will stop the Muslims and blacks from having 50 unsupported kids each…

    • Bill Fortune

      We have to start to restore the 2 parent family first. We need to implement those policies (like in schools, on social media, churches and other organizations) that encourage couples to resolve their relationship issues instead of running to the police and the courts/lawyers.
      Boys and everyone else needs to learn what it is that children need, especially girls, to mature into emotionally healthy adults. This will reduce the dependency on the State/taxpayers.
      Also, welfare is not where the bulk of the money is wasted. Many government agencies could be reduced by at least 1/2, saving billions/yr.
      Bill Fortune, former Chief Steward, Local 4, International Federation of Professional Engineers, AF of L, CIO (DoD, Civil Service)
      Founder, 1971, NH, Fathers United for Equal Justice

  • potusYUGE

    The New York Times… as credible as osama heussein obama!! Lol lol lol

  • travis690

    The writer of the article that appeared in the New York Slimes demonstrates what happens when someone who is uneducated about history and religion puts computer to story and creates a piece of complete fiction that can only serve to confuse the readers of the screed.

    The comparison of Mary and Joseph to a pair of refugees is both incorrect and imbecilic. Returning to the place of one’s birth, however temporary, due to a requirement for a census, is not the same as being displaced from your home by a war.

  • Kathryn Jordan

    I agree with you. I wish, with all my heart, that people would stop embarrassing America with religious bigotry. In the Native American Indian thought it is the Great Spirit for God. What some of these religious bigots don’t realize is that Jesus came into the world to seek the lost “tribes”; that would include the Native American Indians.

    • AKLady

      Religion teaches hate. All religions do.
      Christianity is one of the worst offenders:
      Believe my way or burn for eternity.
      God does not care what name you calling him.
      He does not care what religious sect you follow.
      Be good be kind to your fellow man, remember the Creator gave you all things … That us simple enough. I tis really all He has ever demanded.